The Journal of the Debates in the Convention which framed the Constitution of USA Volume II Part 24

On the motion to insert "_declare_"--in place of "_make_," it was agreed to.

N.H. no. Ma.s.s, abs^t. Con^t no.[33] P^a ay. Del. ay. M^d ay.

V^a ay. N.C. ay. S.C. ay. Geo. ay.

[33] On the remark by M^r King that "_make_" war might be understood to "conduct" it which was an Executive function.

M^r Elsworth gave up his objection, and the vote of Con. was changed to _ay_.--Madison's Note.

M^r Pinkney's motion to strike out whole clause, disag^d to without call of States.

M^r Butler moved to give the Legislature the power of peace, as they were to have that of war.

M^r Gerry 2^{ds} him. 8 Senators may possibly exercise the power if vested in that body, and 14 if all should be present; and may consequently give up part of the U. States. The Senate are more liable to be corrupted by an Enemy than the whole Legislature.

On the motion for adding "and peace" after "war,"

N.H. no. Mas. no. C^t no. P^a no. Del. no. M^d no. V^a no.

N.C. no. S.C. no. Geo. no.

Adjourned.

SAt.u.r.dAY AUGUST 18. IN CONVENTION

M^r Madison submitted, in order to be referred to the Committee of detail the following powers as proper to be added to those of the General Legislature:

"To dispose of the unappropriated lands of the U. States."

"To inst.i.tute temporary Governments for new States arising therein."

"To regulate affairs with the Indians as well within as without the limits of the U. States."

"To exercise exclusively Legislative authority at the seat of the General Government, and over a district around the same, not exceeding ---- square miles; the Consent of the Legislature of the State or States comprising the same, being first obtained."

"To grant charters of incorporation in cases where the public good may require them, and the authority of a single State may be incompetent"

"To secure to literary authors their copy rights for a limited time."

"To establish an University."

"To encourage by premiums & provisions, the advancement of useful knowledge and discoveries."

"To authorize the Executive to procure and hold for the use of the U. S. landed property for the erection of Forts, magazines, and other necessary buildings."

These propositions were referred to the Committee of detail which had prepared the Report and at the same time the following which were moved by M^r Pinkney:--in both cases unanimously:

"To fix and permanently establish the seat of Government of the U. S. in which they shall possess the exclusive right of soil & jurisdiction."

"To establish seminaries for the promotion of literature and the arts & sciences."

"To grant charters of incorporation."

"To grant patents for useful inventions."

"To secure to Authors exclusive rights for a certain time."

"To establish public inst.i.tutions, rewards and immunities for the promotion of agriculture, commerce, trades and manufactures."

"That funds which shall be appropriated for the payment of public Creditors, shall not during the time of such appropriation, be diverted or applied to any other purpose and that the Committee prepare a clause or clauses for restraining the Legislature of the U. S. from establis.h.i.+ng a perpetual revenue."

"To secure the payment of the public debt."

"To secure all creditors under the new Const.i.tution from a violation of the public faith when pledged by the authority of the Legislature."

"To grant letters of mark and reprisal."

"To regulate Stages on the post roads."

M^r Mason introduced the subject of regulating the militia. He thought such a power necessary to be given to the Gen^l Government. He hoped there would be no standing army in time of peace, unless it might be for a few garrisons. The Militia ought therefore to be the more effectually prepared for the public defence. Thirteen States will never concur in any one system, if the disciplining of the Militia be left in their hands. If they will not give up the power over the whole, they probably will over a part as a select militia. He moved as an addition to the propositions just referred to the Comittee of detail, & to be referred in like manner, "a power to regulate the militia."

M^r Gerry remarked that some provision ought to be made in favor of public Securities, and something inserted concerning letters of marque, which he thought not included in the power of war. He proposed that these subjects should also go to a Committee.

M^r Rutlidge moved to refer a clause "that funds appropriated to public creditors should not be diverted to other purposes."

M^r Mason was much attached to the principle, but was afraid such a fetter might be dangerous in time of war. He suggested the necessity of preventing the danger of perpetual revenue which must of necessity subvert the liberty of any country. If it be objected to on the principle of M^r Rutlidge's motion that public Credit may require perpetual provisions, that case might be excepted; it being declared that in other cases, no taxes should be laid for a longer term than ---- years. He considered the caution observed in Great Britain on this point as the paladium of public liberty.

M^r Rutlidge's motion was referred--He then moved that a Grand Committee be appointed to consider the necessity and expediency of the U. States a.s.suming all the State debts--A regular settlement between the Union & the several States would never take place. The a.s.sumption would be just as the State debts were contracted in the common defence. It was necessary, as the taxes on imports the only sure source of revenue were to be given up to the Union. It was politic, as by disburdening the people of the State debts it would conciliate them to the plan.

M^r King and M^r Pinkney seconded the motion. (Col. Mason interposed a motion that the Committee prepare a clause for restraining perpetual revenue, which was agreed to nem. con.)

M^r Sherman thought it would be better to authorize the Legislature to a.s.sume the State debts, than to say positively it should be done. He considered the measure as just and that it would have a good effect to say something about the matter.

M^r Elseworth differed from M^r Sherman. As far as the State debts ought in equity to be a.s.sumed, he conceived that they might and would be so.

M^r Pinkney observed that a great part of the State debts were of such a nature that although in point of policy and true equity they ought, yet would they not be viewed in the light of federal expenditures.

M^r King thought the matter of more consequence than M^r Elseworth seemed to do; and that it was well worthy of commitment. Besides the considerations of justice and policy which had been mentioned, it might be remarked that the State Creditors an active and formidable party would otherwise be opposed to a plan which transferred to the Union the best resources of the States without transferring the State debts at the same time. The State Creditors had generally been the strongest foes to the impost-plan. The State debts probably were of greater amount than the federal. He would not say that it was practicable to consolidate the debts, but he thought it would be prudent to have the subject considered by a Committee.

On M^r Rutlidge's motion, that a Com^e be appointed to consider of the a.s.sumption &c.

N. H. no. Ma.s.s. ay. C^t ay. N. J. no. P^a div^d. Del. no. M^d no. V^a ay. N. C. ay. S. C. ay. Geo. ay.

M^r Gerry's motion to provide for public securities, for stages on post roads, and for letters of marque & reprisal, were committed nem. con.

M^r King suggested that all unlocated lands of particular States ought to be given up if State debts were to be a.s.sumed:--M^r Williamson concurred in the idea.

A Grand Committee was appointed consisting of M^r Langdon, M^r King, M^r Sherman, M^r Livingston, M^r Clymer, M^r d.i.c.kenson, M^r M^cHenry, M^r Mason, M^r Williamson, M^r C. C. Pinkney, M^r Baldwin.